The 'Next Big Thing'? We shudder at the thought: TLOBF meets The Pains Of Being Pure At Heart

Brooklyn’s The Pains Of Being Pure At Heart are back with a gigantic new album, Belong. TLOBF spoke to head-honcho Kip Berman about the making of the record with his dream production team, Flood and Alan Moulder, and how he would “shudder” at the thought of being labeled as the Next Big Thing.

Back in 2009, The Pains Of Being Pure At Heart released their eponymously-titled debut album which revealed a love of the 90s shoegaze genre and bands like My Bloody Valentine, Ride and Slowdive. I first interviewed Kip that summer, on a Monday night ahead of a gig in Wrexham. He was a joy; both buzzing off his band’s progress and happy to meet a fellow fan-boy of Postcard and Sarah Records, and all things The Smiths. He was happy to defend his pillaging of his favourite band’s music and, that night, the kids of the North Wales town seemed “to get it”. A small, but passionate, audience crowd-surfed their way through a fiery set list. It was clear that a connection was being made.

Fast forward two years and The Pains Of Being Pure At Heart return with a follow-up. Produced by two of Kip’s heroes, Alan Moulder and Flood, Belong moves the band towards a bigger, more epic wall of sound. The fact the duo has worked previously with, amongst others, My Bloody Valentine, U2, Smashing Pumpkins points towards the sonic palette Berman was aiming for. Kip is a gentlemen – not only does he remember our previous interview, but he recalls the details of our discussion about my particular favourite My Bloody Valentine.

Warning: this article contains traces of geeking-out about 90s guitar bands.

Congratulations on Belong; it sounds great. You worked with two legends, Flood and Alan Moulder on the record – why did you want to work with them, and how did they help shape the record?

It was really exciting for us because we had this sense of what we wanted; to be really immediate, really visceral and really American, and be really true to the hugeness of guitar bands we listened to like Nirvana and Smashing Pumpkins. Obviously, Alan and Flood understood what we were trying to do, as they had mixed or produced many of those records in the past, so it wasn’t unfamiliar territory in any way. So, I really wanted to work with them because what they had done before was really in the spirit of what our music is all about – big, beautiful, guitar rock music. It was really heartening to know we had this relationship with these talented and kind people and they were going to help us become a better version of us, and not tell us how to become a stadium rock band or something.

How much input did they have – did they give you a huge steer?

We did have ideas that were really clear. They were there to help us not to tell us what to do. It was pretty clear, even though they were famous people, we were telling them what we wanted – it was a pretty strange thing to do.

Did you have a set of songs before you went into the studio – or was there a moment of panic, after which you had to write a whole set of new songs?

We were lucky that we had a lot of time from when our first record was finished, which was like the summer of 2008, before we started recording our second record in the summer of 2010. There wasn’t really a sense of “Oh shit, we need to write some new songs”. From when our first record was complete we had new songs, we just took a while to record them.

And how do these new songs differ from the ones on your debut album?

From a songwriting perspective, I think the songs became more expansive, and less of a “looking backward” style of writing and me trying to make sense of the past. There is more a sense of immediacy; describing life as it is happening in the moment without even seeing the bigger picture, or how it was going to end. There is more evocative language and more of trying to convey this hyper-real sense of the present.

When we met back in the summer of 2009, and you displayed a joyous sense of excitement as the band began to ignite in popularity. Do you still have that sense of wonder?

We are probably a lot closer to what you experienced in Wrexham in our attitudes towards the band. We still have a sense of wonder. There might be an element of we are a little bit older – we’ve seen the struggle of a lot of other people making music and nothing come of it. That’s happened to so many bands we love. It makes us especially aware that most people don’t even get the chance to make a second record. For us to make a second record with these producers we grew up listening to is incredible. At the same time, it makes us want to do the best that we can.

Do you have different expectations for Belong? Is there a sense that you expect more sales and bigger tour venues now?

I was talking with the band the other night, and it is a funny thing that eventually every bands fails. You are a failure if you fail to have success and if you become successful you will eventually become irrelevant and become a failure. Every band will become a failure – it is inevitable. It was quite liberating, because it means you have to enjoy what matters to you. For this record, I don’t know how it is going to be received, but at the same time, I know we made this album how we wanted it to sound and we are proud of it. Whatever happens – even if it gets shat upon – it doesn’t matter because we really love these songs.

Back in Wrexham, you were also really excited to be visiting places that birthed your favourite UK bands; we geeked-out together about Postcard Records and The Smiths. Are you still a fan-boy and what were your favourite cities?

Well, Glasgow and Manchester, but also Bristol; I’m not sure what their music scene is like now, but it was the home of Sarah Records which is an important label to us. Also, when we were recording this record, there was another band upstairs who were involved with Alan McGee. We are massive Creation fans so we went upstairs when he was around and shook his hand. He is involved in so much of what we love about independent music on this side of the Atlantic. So, I think the geek-factor never goes away.

You wear your influences proudly. Since your last record, there are a number of bands who are making great music – like Ringo Deathstarr and Yuck – who share similar sources of inspiration. Is there a sense that you have created space for these bands to be accepted?

That’s flattering, but I don’t think it is the case. So many bands grew up idolising other bands. The Ramones loved The Stooges, but they weren’t The Stooges – they were The Ramones. True creativity came out of the failure to imitate. I never feel bad when people point out that our music is carrying on a previous thing because all the best bands incorporate ideas from the past. So much of the music I have written was inspired by a band I like, and then a band they liked, be it from Nirvana to The Vaselines and back to Orange Juice – it’s like a wonderful family tree to connect. Obviously, we are excited if bands feel that in some way our music has helped their music be more easily understood. But, I don’t think any of these bands need our help – they are doing pretty well and getting a lot of attention.

But do you feel that you are spearheading a scene that includes a number of bands influenced by the 90s shoegaze genre?

No, not all. In the UK, you seem to need to have a scene or a band of the moment or a perfect album for the summer. Honestly, you know, I don’t want to be the Next Big Thing – the way it is presented is very trend-orientated. I don’t like the idea of being trendy in the moment, I want to make a record that you can listen to in ten years and will still mean something in terms of being good pop songs. There is something about good music that if it is truly good will last and doesn’t have to be the most popular thing in the moment. Some of the best-loved music was particularly understood when it was made but over time it became popular. That to me is far more exciting than the chance to be on a magazine cover for one month. I know that most American bands feel that way, and I think there is a sort of divide, in terms of intention, from English bands who aspire to be the Next Big Thing. We shudder at that phrase. It is almost a curse that you are only of that moment.

With regards to Belong, a number of the songs seem to be about troublesome relationships. Did you have someone in mind when you wrote ‘My Terrible Friend’?

Ha ha. It’s the idea that you have this person that is bad news but you like them anyway and you do bad things with them, even when you know you shouldn’t. It’s quite emblematic of the album in some ways – it’s an ‘I know this is wrong, but it feels right’ moment. It’s the same as ‘Anne With An E’ and the line “Let’s go out tonight / And do something wrong” – it’s almost about embracing bad things in a sex and drugs and rock’n’roll sort of way.

And, finally, the album artwork is stunning – an oil-painting of a boy. Who was the artist and why did you choose it for the cover?

Thank you. It’s by a young artist from Brooklyn called Winston Chmielinski – he has done our artwork since the ‘Say No To Love’ single and we really like the idea of visual consistency throughout our album and singles. With the album, there is more colour in the sound, it’s more vibrant-sounding; it’s not just black and white. There is a lot more texture – the album sounds like it is in colour. Also, there is something beautiful about the image, as the kid has a black eye.

The album Belong is out March 28 via Fortuna Pop!

The Pains of Being Pure At Heart – Belong by Slumberland Records